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The sad part is women that really need to read the article won't
JSin
The sad part is women that really need to read the article won't
JSin
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, May 11, 2009 - 11:01 AMSome women get it; Taking care of ourselves is essential to a great relationship. I love sex for me, I don't need anyone to validate that.
Self-love , that's the key. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, May 11, 2009 - 11:09 AMTotally works the other way around too. Lots of men not loving themselves, being depressed, workaholics, repressed anger/sadness. Escaping into their computers/work/alcohol. They could be going to the doctor and couple's therapy too.
Taking good care of ourselves is the only way to take good care of others.
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Unsu...
Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, May 25, 2009 - 11:49 AMBlow jobs save marriages?
Unfortunately there is a lot more to marriage than sex. The sex in our marriage was great. I loved everything he wanted to try. Deep throating was one of the most enjoyable acts for me (and him). If we could have lived our marriage in the bedroom, the marriage would have lived. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, May 26, 2009 - 9:40 AMTaking away oral sex DESTROYS a sexual relationship. At least for me, because I adore oral sex so much. Fortunately my new GF understands how a good blow job can change my mood from dark to shiny.
I do the same for her when she needs an attitude adjustment.
Sex doesn't fix everything in a relationship, but it surely makes life more tolerable. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, May 26, 2009 - 10:24 AMwell thankfully there is a wide variety in men. Some men seem to think that a blow job will save there marriage and some men could get all the blow jobs they want and still have some loftier goals marriage wise.
Ron, Jsin, this women seems to speak to you. I'm still thinking there is more to marriage than sex. I hope we all find what we are looking for. -
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Unsu...
Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, May 26, 2009 - 12:43 PMAh yes, deep moving discussion - will more blowjobs make a man's marriage better. The answer is no.
If you're marriage is at such superficial levels, then unlimited blowjobs isn't going to fix it. Husbands won't have to worry about blue balls, but that's certainly not going to save the marriage.
Aschleigh, there IS more to marriage than sex: if you have trust, acceptance, communication, and all the other cliched blah blahs, the sex part takes care of itself BIG TIME.
Nothing is quite as arousing as having complete trust that your partner isn't going to stab you in the back, and vica versa. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, May 26, 2009 - 7:25 PMyeah I dig on complete trust big time.
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, May 27, 2009 - 1:22 PMAs usual you missed the point ashleigh. The holding out of oral contributes to downfall, not that the relationship is solely based on sex... You are foolish if you believe that a sexless relationship is going to be as fulfilling as one that has a positive sexual component.
BTW just out of curiosity what are these loftier goals that seem to preclude sexual satisfaction and appreciation? Do tell and let me know how a woman occasionally bobbing my knob keeps me from attaining them.
JSin -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, May 27, 2009 - 1:29 PMI am totally in favor of a sexful fulfilling sexual relationship and loftier goals. I even think my sexual goals are loftier than yours probably.
It is not Either/Or. It's sex and a fulfilling relationship. Sex as a part of a fulfilling relationship. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, May 27, 2009 - 1:33 PMAh once again you make assumptions... But lets see you claim your sexual goals are loftier... so do tell what are these lofty goals and define how you can reasonably evaluate when one sexual goal is of higher value than another.
You just said it is not either or. The article doesn't say it is either or as well. Perhaps you should re read what she is saying.
But before you argue that one let us all know what these lofty sexual goals are you are so versed in.
JSin -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, May 27, 2009 - 1:43 PMI don't think we have anything to argue about here.
When sex is in the service of higher ideas like love, communion, kindness, compassionate ,that constitutes loftier goals for me. No one needs to have my goals or lofty goals at all sexuality wise. I'm not as versed as I'd like to be , that's why I like learning. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, May 27, 2009 - 2:23 PMWell then once again as I had thought you did make some greivious assumptions about me. The big difference is that i also think sex should be fun, exiting and above all that friendly. While loftier goals are all fine and dandy it is not the only reason to have sex in one's life.
JSin -
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This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, May 27, 2009 - 2:50 PMIf friendly sex is your goal than that's cool. I think there can be more to sex than a friendly interaction. I know there can be more.
I wonder this about a lot of people and things. If you knew there was friendly sex and meaningful loving sex why would you choose the lesser? Like If you can get a Bachelor's why not get a master's. I am not saying bigger is better. A mansion isn't better to live in than a great apartment by the sea. I'm wondering why you would settle for less than you could have quality wise.
I agree lofty goals are not the only reason to have sex. Procreating and companionship and it's fun too. But what if you could have it all? What if you could have anything if you decide you want it and are willing to do the work for it.
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sat, July 25, 2009 - 4:21 PMAschleigh assumed:
<well thankfully there is a wide variety in men. Some men seem to think that a blow job will save there marriage and some men could get all the blow jobs they want and still have some loftier goals marriage wise.
Ron, Jsin, this women seems to speak to you. I'm still thinking there is more to marriage than sex. I hope we all find what we are looking for.>
Let me ask you something Aschleigh, have you ever been in a relationship that crumbled due to a lack of sex on either partner's part?
I've had 1 marriage and 2 quite deep and long term relationships go to shit because of it. Personally, I have vowed to myself never to be in another sexless relationship EVER. I broke that promise to myself with my last GF and suffered greatly because of it. Every day that I suffered through the sexual denial hurt me down to my core. I'm a highly sexual and sensual person and having our sex life die was like mental suicide to me.
In all 3 of the instances that I mention above, it would have been amazing how much the simple act of fellatio (or any sex together for that matter) would have restored our pleasure of being around each other.
Oh well, I live and learn... -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sun, July 26, 2009 - 12:40 PMDid all the relationships die from a lack of sex, Ron, or were there OTHER unresolved issues that led to the sex going away?
Sometimes, yes, a woman (or man) enters into a partnership being deceptive about liking sex, or a particular sex act to hook a partner. That's bad news all around. But when 2 people who were genuinely hot for one another are having problems in that area, it's a different story.
I can tell you first hand, that when someone is feeling drained by a partner who doesn't pull their own weight, when one's sexual desire for that person drops because of it, caring for the sexual needs of the person we're fed up with, especially in an unselfish way, can feel like an invasive chore.
Working off some short-term anger can fuel some pretty hot sex.
Long-term, simmering, resentful, frustrated anger usually kills it. Because under such anger, lies sadness, even grief.
See below, for what I wrote about people who think sex is OWED to them, just because they've shown up.
Male privilege is the casual assumption that males & their needs are simply more important. Maybe the roots of that lie deep in the fact that at a strictly biological, evolutionary level, we simply don't need as many men around as women.
So many men need this constant reassurance that they matter- matter more, in fact. Their needs are supposed to come first. Like BABIES...& so very NOT sexy.
I take people for who they are as individuals. And there is much I respect & enjoy about traditional masculine traits. Two of my closest long-time friends are guys, both of whom are quite traditionally macho is different ways. One is an uber-bright techy who's made oddles of cash & was pulling the chicks long before that; the other does hard-core martial arts, is very outdoorsy, & is currently off working fire-fighting crew- in his 40's no less. My bio brother is similar- very athletic, very successful lawyer w/ a hard-partying past. Married to a beautiful, very bright woman he's been w/ since college.
I've discussed this subject w/ all of them at various times. We all basically agree that NO ONE who loves sex is happy when it dries up. And that major deception always messes w/ a couple's trust & intimacy.
Sometimes sex goes away because of things like infants, kids & stress, sometimes it's health stuff, sometimes there are unresolved long-standing problems w/ the relationship.
We all agree, from hard-won experience:
Whatever the reasons, it's up to BOTH parties to work things out . Because that's what real PARTNERS do. And that if one's partner takes care of one's sexual needs when they're just not feeling it, be very APPRECIATIVE. And that especially in times of high stress or exhaustion (like new baby or illness) don't just EXPECT that sex will be a given, just because someone wants it. And that goes tenfold when there are deep problems in the relationship.
These men understand that their wives & lovers do not exist FOR them. Which is a big part of why I love them.
Myself & these men all have naturally high sex drives. And yet, we all "get it." Like I said... this is about a lot more than orgasms.
It's about power. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sun, July 26, 2009 - 1:17 PM"people who think sex is OWED to them, just because they've shown up. "
Ah yes, the virus of "Entitlement". Plaguing relationships everywhere...
Often, that mindset alone is the problem. and yes, it does go back to control, which is on the path of insecurity.
A gift is only a gift when it's given freely. When expectation is attatched, it becomes nothing more than payment for services.
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sun, July 26, 2009 - 6:56 PM<Did all the relationships die from a lack of sex, Ron, or were there OTHER unresolved issues that led to the sex going away?>
Every relationship has it's issues. But once the sex dies, so does one's desire to work on those issues etc...
I'm not saying that sex would have saved any of those relationships, but it CERTAINLY would have made the other issues more tolerable. No one owes me sex, but cutting off sex surely contributed to the decay and eventual death of those relationships. Let's face it, life is much more tolerable with a healthy sex life. No matter how bad problems get, I would never cut my partner off from sex and expect things to get better. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, July 27, 2009 - 12:28 AMThat's compartmentalizing. It has it's uses... but in the end, doing a lot of that cuts us off from real intimacy, & a chance to really learn to pay attention to what someone else is feeling. In it's own way, that sense of entitlement uses sex as a weapon.
And it's the kind of thing that in relationships that really mean something, breaks a lot of hearts, & frequently kills a desire for sex . Because it means that one, maybe both people are checked out. It feels bad. It feels unsafe... & not in that "risk for fun" kinda way. One has to be willing to be vulnerable to have really hot, intimate sex w/ someone we care for. Especially if we are the one being entered, literally letting someone inside us.
Sometimes, being vulnerable to someone ceases to be a good idea.
I get it that sex is the glue. But if intimacy & trust are compromised, & the genuine effort to repair the rift either isn't being made, or isn't working... then it's arrogant to just think one is entitled. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, July 27, 2009 - 8:42 AM<I get it that sex is the glue. But if intimacy & trust are compromised, & the genuine effort to repair the rift either isn't being made, or isn't working... then it's arrogant to just think one is entitled.>
No matter how hard you try sometimes, things don't work out. It wouldn't matter how bad things get, I would never change the way I treat someone I love. I certainly wouldn't cut them off from sex, but I guess that is just my perspective. Sex is more than glue from my perspective, it's like water or oxygen. Relationships die without it.
The real key to a happy relationship is how you deal with the hard times. If you choose to deal with it by retreating from the sexual relationship, that is your right. But please don't expect me to hang around or be happy with your decision. I do feel entitled to have a rich and healthy sex life with someone who claims to love me, just like I would expect someone who claims to love me would not change they way they treat me no matter how bad things get.
I'm lucky to be with someone who has been through similar circumstances and has promised me that she would never treat me differently no matter how bad things get. So far her actions have shown me she means what she says. Our relationship has started up during a shit storm of bad things and she has stood by me, and hasn't changed how she treats me one bit.
Huge bonus that the sex is incredible as well :D -
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This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, July 27, 2009 - 9:17 AMLet me ask you something Aschleigh, have you ever been in a relationship that crumbled due to a lack of sex on either partner's part?
In all 3 of the instances that I mention above, it would have been amazing how much the simple act of fellatio (or any sex together for that matter) would have restored OUR pleasure of being around each other.
Ron, there are two sides to a relationship ( at least two sides) . I have been in relationships that crumbled but not because of my not being available for sex ( my part, the part I can control)
"would have restored our pleasure of being around each other. " That's your perspective, which is valid but not necesarrily what she was thinking. She could have given you felatio and hated herself for it. She may not have felt restored pleasure about being around each other from giving you oral sex. Ddi you ask her " what would restore your pleasure about being around me? " , becasue apperantly giving you blow jobs wasn't working for her.( Although she would need to speak for herself for us to really know, next time why not find out) -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, July 27, 2009 - 9:31 AM"I do feel entitled to have a rich and healthy sex life with someone who claims to love me"
I know a women whose husband left her after she gave birth to their child and then went through a year of post parttum depression, where she did not want to have sex, she was also nursing and full time parenting in that year of depression.
There are any number of reasons , health, physical disatance, etc.. that the sex in a relationship may take a hiatus. If my husband stopped holding me tight and telling me he was there for me as I was going through whatever happens after giving birth or the death of a parent or cancer or telling me how much he wanted to hold me as I was off to my book tour, I would not want to have sex with him at all. And I am really into having sex, but come on life happens too. I didn't see any " I wonder what is going on innerally for her, as she was not outwardly wanting sex?" in your posts. That wondering might have helped. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, July 27, 2009 - 10:32 AMI have also see many men who do not talk or have conversations on any problem that may need communication
to the point that women withdraw physically. Up until that point, the man did not notice.
He did not notice when her needs were not met and she tried to tell him, he only noticed when his needs stopped being met.
And it is not so much that she is "punishing" him for anything, more over she is to the point of feeling detatched becasue he has avoided her other cues.
Men do this too, but they withdraw emotionally. Which can be just as devistating to the woman and the relationship.
It is so textbook, yet so common.
Made millions for Dr. Phill............................
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, July 27, 2009 - 11:07 AMyeah, I'd venture to guess that's what Ron did not get in those relationships.
At this point I don't think it's worth dating a guy who hasn't had a real conscious conversion to " I must communicate my needs" and "looking into the needs of my partner( and if/how they are being met ) is good for my relationship, the sex part too" .
So women, ( and people ) will withhold sex until they communicate their needs directly and/or have partners who are receptive to listening and making changes where needed.
Are you hearing this Ron? -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, July 27, 2009 - 11:31 AMNo one is justifiied in hurting you . I wonder if what you took for her hurting you was not just her inclination to not have sex with you because she wasn't attracted to you anymore.
I also get that financial distaster is much different for men ( we still live in a society that puts more pressure on men to make money). I can be broke and feel all hot and sexy. I am attracted to provider types. Maybe she was too and didn't think you were providing and that cut her sexual attraction down considerably. This is all speculation. But I can see myself, with surgery ( and pain! hello) and kids that needs lots of attention and a boyfriend who wants a blow job and some anger and no attraction happening. That's a lot surgery, kids, financial worries. Still I see the point of trying to connect with sex. Your needs were not being met, her needs were not being met. Someone had to go out on a limb and say something or do something. I'm all biased but why not relationship counseling, getting a third ( educated) party's opinion? -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, July 27, 2009 - 2:07 PMI don't 'withhold' sex, if I'm upset, I just don't feel into it. Withholding is still manipulative. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, July 27, 2009 - 5:28 PMsome people don't really know when they are upset, not consciously . And if they do they don't think that communicating it directly will change much or want to go through the trouble of not getting what they want but being honest or don't have the words to communicate or the nueral pathways open to doing any of the above. Lots of people are really shut down.
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, July 27, 2009 - 6:21 PM<I don't 'withhold' sex, if I'm upset, I just don't feel into it. Withholding is still manipulative.>
Thanks Quel, I'm glad my new GF is a lot like you. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, July 27, 2009 - 11:06 PMDon't speak too soon, Ron. I have been very turned off from sex when there are underlying problems and I can't even make myself do it. I just had a semantic issue with the word 'withhold'. as if it were being taken off the table willingly. If something emotional or physical dampens my libido, I will not be there just to serve. Sex is a mutual sharing of intimacy and if it can't be maximized, it shouldn't happen. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, July 28, 2009 - 11:04 AMI seriously don't know why a women would put up with that. It's painful hearing it on the internet much less living it.
It's a huge shift internally when I figured that being single ( and dating and having sex ) was way better than that kind of man drain.
Ron, did any of this get through to you? You were going around asking for blow jobs as she was in pain, dealing with needy kids and stressed financially. And she was withholding sex? -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, July 28, 2009 - 5:02 PM>You were going around asking for blow jobs as she was in pain, dealing with needy kids and stressed financially. And she was withholding sex?
Maybe it's just because I'm hot and grumpy, but I'm not seeing Ron as forcing his GF to give him blow jobs while she dealt with her surgery and special needs children. Ron was sharing his experience with a relationship wherein he and his ex-GF didn't see eye to eye wrt to sex; he wanted more and she didn't feel it. He isn't wrong to raise that point, and she wasn't wrong to not meet him half way (I wouldn't feel sexual either, if I were her, under the circumstances). And, to be honest, if I were involved with a man with special needs children that weren't mine, I can see where issues might arise, but how we dealt with that would depend on our intimate connection (sexual or not, intimacy is more than sex, obviously). Maybe the real problem that Ron is discussing is that that relationship was too much for him and the intimacy level wasn't there, it just didn't work out for him; in other words, the lack of sex was symptomatic of a mismatch.
Playing Devil's advocate, I would argue that Ron may have hung in there with a bad relationship for him because he couldn't abandon his ex-GF when she had surgery and because she was managing special needs children.
Having had a relationship wherein sex was a problem (he hardly wanted it at all and I wanted a lot), I can say that no matter what the circumstances, differing expectations about sex does lead to problems. My current relationship is much better because we have similar libidos and situations that posed barriers to sex in my previous relationships don't now because we both use sex to express similar feelings and we both find it to be a similar kind of escape, meditation or whatever. Ron, I think, is saying something similar about his
current relationship.
Okay, have at me.
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Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, July 28, 2009 - 11:50 PMI actually agree w/ much of what you wrote, Miss Mini. And like many people have been on both ends of this equation, at different times & in different relationships.
My point is that whatever differences come up, no one can "withhold" something that is strictly theirs to give (or not) in the first place. No one is automatically entitled.
And Ron knows why some of us are saying what we are to him... or he should. No one can know all the insides of anyone elses relationships. But some things are just facts.
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, July 29, 2009 - 11:02 AMI think you hit the nail on the head, MissMini.....
"the lack of sex was symptomatic of a mismatch."
I think we would all agree that for a relationship to have longevity, there have to be other factors to sustain it besides just sex.
So if the physical act of sex holds enough weight to determines if a relationship succeeds or fails,
it wasn't much of a relationship to begin with....
Also, I recall reading...Circumstances do not define us, they reveal us.
I think that could apply to our relationships as well. Good matches can endure a great deal.
When the hard times hit, you see what the relationship is really made of....
Atleast, that is what I have expreienced....
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, July 29, 2009 - 1:48 PMI'm not seeing Ron as forcing his GF to give him blow jobs .
I don't detect any forcing going on either.
I don't know if I give that much weight to a right match. People could be a basically perfect match and then have several difficult things happen all at once and not feel like having sex for a while. I do like the Circumstances do not define us, they reveal us.
We know a little of what happens with Ron when he's not getting the sex he wants. Relationships reveal who we are like nothing else. How we handle not getting what we want says alot. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, July 29, 2009 - 2:36 PM>I don't know if I give that much weight to a right match.
I don't mean on paper matching like eharmony or something, I meant a certain synergy that happens when two people meet at the right time and have enough going between them to keep them going through tough times. Certainly circumstances can change and reveal something about us under trying times, as One In Motion noted. If the relationship is a good fit (in a cosmic, non-mechanical way), sexual deserts can be dealt with, but if the connection is not strong, then sexual issues will cause problems.
Maybe we can't know how good our relationships are until they've been tested by tough circumstances.
I certainly agree that how we handle what we are not getting says a lot about us. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, July 29, 2009 - 3:14 PMyes, I know that's what I yearn for most. All that other stuff seems superilous. It's that deep connection and the sense that we will work it, no matter what, that has been missing in my relationships. I know I will recognize it when I feel it.
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, July 27, 2009 - 11:03 AM<Ddi you ask her " what would restore your pleasure about being around me? " , becasue apperantly giving you blow jobs wasn't working for her.( Although she would need to speak for herself for us to really know, next time why not find out)>
I was ridiculously patient when things got tough for her. She had a surgery that derailed our sex life for months, and I hung in there. She had horrible problems with her kids (who are special needs), and I stood by her. But things were very tough for me last year financially and she claimed that she was supporting me (which wasn't true) and she poured water on me as I drowned and constantly said things that were meant to lower my self esteem. I would understand such a position if I was laying around her house watching her TV and eating her potato chips all day, but I was busting my ass trying to keep my business afloat during another economic disaster.
She had been ripped off financially by other husbands/boyfriends and she took that anger out on me by cutting off our sex life.
My life is so much better now that I don't have to live up to someone else's expectations, and my sex life is 1000% better as well. I have someone who appreciates how hard I work, and doesn't take her stuff out on me.
I told the Ex GF over and over again how much cutting off our sex life was hurting me and that I had been wounded that way before, but she chose to ignore my feelings and keep giving me a hard time about my situation.
If you feel that she was justified in hurting me the way she did, more power to you. I'm just glad that there is a good chance I'll never have to live through that kind of abuse again. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, July 27, 2009 - 9:38 PMi just want to make sure i'm hearing this right -- i know that there are always at least two sides to every story... but here it sounds like you're saying that your ex had surgery that affected her for months, that she's been dealing with horrible problems with her special needs kids, and on top of that she took on extra financial responsibility when you weren't keeping your business afloat... but you think she was just being mean to you because she wasn't into having sex, and that you're the good guy for being so patient with her, and that she's the one who hurt you.
go figure. i don't think i'd be feeling so frisky either. health concerns, kid concerns and a partner who isn't able to do their part. i've been there, done that, and for me, too, it will never happen again. it's not that i would take it out on another person, it's that i would recognize what was happening sooner. and the situation sounds like pretty much a surefire turnoff. maybe expecting her to feel sexy in that situation isn't paying attention to *her* feelings.
at least it sounds like you had a new girlfriend at the ready who doesn't expect anything. best of luck to you, ron.
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Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, July 28, 2009 - 3:05 PMRon, I think you have crossed a line with your discussion topic here and you know what I mean. Maybe it's best of you let this one go quietly into the night of Tribe. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, July 29, 2009 - 4:14 PMI've made my point.
Claims of my ex supporting me were greatly exaggerated and I am doing better than ever financially. Didn't happen by accident, I've done lots of hard work to get to the place I'm in now. If you've ever run your own business, you would understand how painful downtimes can be. Downtimes don't last forever if you work hard and stand your ground the way I do.
The crux of my point though which was completely lost in this thread, is that money comes and goes. But the way you treat each other during tough times, and attitudes towards sex during those times is instrumental to a good loving and stable relationship. At least to me. YMMV. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Thu, July 30, 2009 - 1:52 AMI wasn't going to get specific, Ron.
But since you did...
As a matter of fact, I've been self employed, doing various kinds of art, crafts & performance for years. I've done all kinds of stuff ranging from singing telegrams/street musician/factory night shifts/ deliveries/ freelance editing, etc.etc. ect. to pay my OWN way. Altho' I've been lucky enough to receive some lovely gifts over the years, I'm careful to make sure they don't come w/ strings. I've made some smart & lucky investments, & am OK now. But no matter how down & out, I've never let a lover support me. Especially if he had children- they come first. I don't have kids, so no one owes me. I didn't make babies & raise them for anyone...
In addition, every male in my immediate family for the last several generations has ended up working for himself. I grew up in a household where at some point, we all worked at the used construction equipment business my Dad & Grandpa started in a tin shack, in & muddy lot in Brooklyn, building from the ground up, w/ few funds. We learned to take messages at home from the time we were in preschool, & were always stopping to look at some truck dad might buy. When my brother & i were older, Mom did the bookeeping.
So I know EXACTLY what the sacrifices of starting & running a business entail. Running yr own business is NO excuse for letting a single mom pay yr rent for months on end. There are reasons that would justify it for awhile, in a well-established relationship, like long illness or a bad injury... but that's about it.
And my point, is that sex is part of a whole relationship, of life. Expecting it just because it's what we want, no matter what's happening for our partners, no matter what frustrations they've expressed, is arrogant & childish.
And no- she has no idea I'm posting about this. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Thu, July 30, 2009 - 9:14 AMRon, you've made your point and it was very unsexy.
See Jsin, there are a lot of chicks that get it. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Thu, July 30, 2009 - 10:14 AM:) *stand and applaude* -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Thu, July 30, 2009 - 2:53 PMCORRECTION: "there are a lot of chicks that get it."
hence =
:) stand and applaude...
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Re: A chick that gets it
Thu, July 30, 2009 - 11:50 AMnot sure exactly what your point is, ron. i am self employed, and i understand down times, and i have seen several pretty rough periods -- but i can't imagine letting someone else support me financially for an extended period of time, particularly if they had other major things in their life that they had to deal with.
and yes, money can stress a relationship immensely. in fact, i'd probably assert that it's more important to be a fully self-supporting financial contributor in a relationship than it is to give sexual favors. no amount of oral sex makes up for not putting in one's fair share of the household expenses in the long run, unless there is an explicit agreement otherwise.
i'm glad you're in such a good financial place now, and i hope you're paying back the people who supported you during the tough times, starting with your ex.
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Re: A chick that gets it
Fri, July 31, 2009 - 12:31 AMEh. You know what you need to do, Ron, regardless of whether people understand your point or not.
Keep at it, bucko.
~ Kole -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Fri, July 31, 2009 - 6:22 PMwait, one in motion, are you applauding me?
Because I am all about the taking in fully of good things these days.
Hopefully someday, there doesn't need to be this competion type thing, Either he gets his needs met or she gets her needs met. That people routinely express their needs well before there is anger or resentment. I will try. It might have worked to say " I'm not feeling very connected with you, I'm feeling sad that we aren't having the sex we used to or having great sex anymore. I'm sorry that things are tough, etc, etc..,etc.. How can we work through this?" or it might not have.
I still think a great connection needs great communication too. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sat, August 1, 2009 - 8:33 AMFMM accused:
<But no matter how down & out, I've never let a lover support me. Especially if he had children- they come first. I don't have kids, so no one owes me. I didn't make babies & raise them for anyone... >
This is my point exactly, she wasn't supporting me no matter how great her claims. You are someone who doesn't have all the fact and you are making a point based on her side of the story which is BS. It's a big part of why we broke up, but to be honest sex life death is the true death nell.
I should have broken it off as soon as the sex life died honestly. Not a sexy point to some, but the truth none the less.
I don't care of the fucking world is coming to an end, I still want sex to be part of my life. Don't like it, then lump it in my book. I'm never putting up with a sexless relationship again period. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sat, August 1, 2009 - 9:46 AMAschleigh did a great job of dodging this question and turning things around at me:
<Let me ask you something Aschleigh, have you ever been in a relationship that crumbled due to a lack of sex on either partner's part?>
Simple question that got buried under a sea of accusations. So Aschleigh? Do we get a response?
Are you hearing me? -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sat, August 1, 2009 - 11:51 AMI think it's the opposite of classy to use this forum to debate the particulars of your relationship with someone that many of us know. You are achieving the opposite of your intended result and cementing the negative image of yourself further. Have some tact, please. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sat, August 1, 2009 - 1:39 PMYour ex showed a lot of class & patience- probably two much. She didn't complain to anyone for a very long time, & then gave you many chances to make more of a contribution on a regular basis, really wanted to work things out.
.Bills & rent receipts do not lie. She's a strong woman of character, who has a LOT on her plate already, & zero reason to lie, given she's not into drawing things out at all. Besides the surgery, it's quite common for a woman's desire to die when she feels like what she thought was her man, her equal partner, is yet another child that must be taken care of.
I've been there. And also on the other end of the equation, w/ a brilliant, talented man I loved, who was unstable due to a childhood from hell... I tried to hang in there for him, but the crazy-wild sex then no sex, then lies became so draining I had to get out.
Under different circumstances, she would have wished for a friendship, which would now be difficult. She hasn't been deceptive... which is not the deal in yr case, Ron.
So who's character comes out looking more trustworthy?
I wish you luck in yr business, & love w/ yr low-maintenance new partner. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sat, August 1, 2009 - 5:17 PMFrom my response on july 27th:
I have been in relationships that crumbled but not because of my not being available for sex ( my part, the part I can control)
I've had sex with the people I was in a relationship with, after the relationship was dead. The sex outlasted the relationship.
Ron, you associate the reason your relationship crumbled with sex or lack thereof. She probably does not. You have a valid piont of view, I still see no effort to see other points of view. This is where couples counseling or even self-reflection comes into play.
Ron, do you see the purpose of not having sex with you to try to get you to see that somethings very wrong here?
Would you have noticed that without the death of your sexlife? Do you think there may be a way to prevent that in the future? -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sat, August 1, 2009 - 5:23 PMI dont know Ron's ex, and Ron is putting himself and his actions out there for a reason. I think it's fair game we analyze .
People like getting caught. There wasn't any indication that Ron was enjoying what went down with the ex, he just didn't have the skills to go other ways with it. This may be his way of learning , if not other skills, over viewpoints.
Maybe when this girlfriend isn't into giving him anymore blowjobs, he rereads this or gets an even lower matience girl. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sat, August 1, 2009 - 6:31 PMAsch, I'm sure you wouldn't like it very much if he was talking about you. Would complaints about you be fair game in a tribe you're a member of? This isn't about a dispute re: a thread. This is airing the laundry of what happened at one's most vulnerable. If the person being talked about isn't anonymous, it's tacky. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sun, August 2, 2009 - 1:28 PMShe's anonymous to me and probably most people here.
It's a really good sign that if your relationship is being talked about on the internet then it has not been worked out in the place it needed to be worked out, between the two people involved.
We might as well learn from there ( and our own ) mistakes. I'm ok with tacky , it has it's purposes.
I don't get the feeling that we are judging this women, other than to hope she has a better boyfriend now. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sun, August 2, 2009 - 4:00 PMYou've totally missed the point and have completely discounted feelings she might have about being discussed. For someone who claims to be all about helping people have better lives, you sure lack empathy and sensitivity. I heard that happens to shrinks, you get so jazzed about the analysis and neglect the humane aspects of it.
I'm quite confident that you're okay with tacky. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sun, August 2, 2009 - 4:39 PMWhat is this thread about? -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 5:31 PM>What is this thread about?
At some point, it was a general discussion as to why men like blowjobs in relationships, granted a facile topic that doesn't require a lot of deliberation. The gist seems to have drifted a bit. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 5:47 PMyes, I wish someone would start more intelligent posts. Or a moderator that would delete the non-intelligent posts.
Makes me think of what really is a sexy man. Or who would volunteer themselves as a sexy man, may not be sexy to me at all. I'm looking for a sexy mind , a sexy bank account wouldn't hurt either.
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sun, August 2, 2009 - 8:13 PM>>>She's anonymous to me and probably most people here.
not true.... -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 9:24 AMIf she has feelings about being discussed, let her speak up about them. She doesn't seem to be trying to quell discussion.
This discussion is also about Ron, which he has every right to speak about ( as do we) .
Let's let people speak for themselves, or remain silent if that's what they choose. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 10:22 AMand since she has tact, she's not airing out Ron's dirty laundry. I guess that's something about which you know nothing, tact. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 10:52 AMBite Me is Ron's ex? I didn't know, I'm still not sure, but that would explain some things. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 11:05 AMI certainly don't know ron or any of his ex's. It's his dirty laundry to air if he chooses to, that's my only point. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 1:42 PMit may be his dirty laundry to air, but he is choosing to do it in a forum where he knows his ex is -- and where he knows that many of his ex's real-life friends are, many of whom know what went down -- and that is indeed tacky.
as i said before, i know that there are always two sides to the story of a breakup. there's rarely just a good guy and a bad guy. life is complicated. and many things are subjective and open to interpretation.
hence, here we have someone who didn't pay their way in a relationship, down to seriously risking the credit of the person who did step up to help them out, and who had a new girlfriend waiting in the wings, who feels righteous in calling themselves "ridiculously patient" and "abused" because they didn't get the kind of sex they wanted, while the other party might feel well entitled to feel they were the patient one.
so sure, it's his dirty laundry to air. but don't expect that the neighbors might not have some opinions about it.
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 3:23 PMWhat I'm curious about is why Ron has opened himself up to this kind of scrutiny. He's got to know all that you mentioned Leslie about his ex's friends.
I imagine we are in this little village in Italy where we can actually hear the neighbors yelling at each other .
Seems like there is much unresolved on Ron's side at least about this relationship and this is the perfect place to get some of that aired. I'm interested, it's an interesting situation. I'll bet it isn't just ron who has unresolved issues from past relationships that they can deal with after the relationship has ended, or with a new partner. We encounter the same stuff over and over again in each relationship beause we encounter ourselves over and over again.
I'm sure I have an ex who feels resentments towards me.( not lack of sex resentments) Ron has some valid points.
How do we resolved these things if we don't air them ? I mean depending on the person, I suppose some can go into their cave and come out all healed. I tend to think healing trumps tact .
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 5:06 PMUm, she was anonymous to me and still is.
If no one had even bothered mentioning that it involved someone who posts here, I wouldn't have even -considered- that someone here was involved.
I think dwelling on that, rather than learning from it as an abstract example, puts the attention where it doesn't need to be.
~ Kole -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 5:18 PMyes Kole.
Likewise perhaps she wants to be known too. She spoke up and then Quel confirmed who she was. Maybe they want to be known, why else chime in at all. If they wanted to stay anonymous they could have. I'm smart but I couldn't have guessed who ron's ex was out of all the women on earth.
I feel like a kid with my parents, this drama. Good reminder to not put kids through this EVER. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 6:00 PMWay to condescend, Asch. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 9:10 PMYup, had no intention of getting this specific. It relates to the topic, but I had intended to stay more abstract, & tried to warn Ron off in an earlier post. Some of us here know one another in RL.
I know that no one is perfect, & every relationship break-up has 2 sides. But don't make underhanded, increasingly specific inferences that I know to be bullshit about my friend, & expect me to stand by & say nothing...while gloating about a relationship that was started under deceptive circumstances.
Ron's ex has such loyal friends for good reasons- she's a good & honest person.
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Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, August 4, 2009 - 12:32 PMashleigh, you actually are continuing to push "this drama" by trying to do some armchair psych diagnosis of the people involved. really, don't.
as fmm said, and she summed it up well, ron knows that his ex has loyal friends here. we know who's solid and responsible, and expecting us to allow her to be discredited or misrepresented just ain't gonna happen.
and for someone who's preparing to be a psychologist, i hope you can grow past feeling like a child in the presence of disagreements. you'll be needing to deal with a lot of them without getting personally activated. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, August 4, 2009 - 1:01 PMThat's really interested. I am curious what everyone felt needed defending. I got the feeling that Ron's ex came off pretty good.
Transferance is actually when we do get personally activiated and then paying attention to it and being able to use it productively. Being personally activated can't be avoided unless we are some kind of yogi, guru, zen master . IE. way beyond where I am now.
Being told what to do , I wonder if particuallry by an older women, activates my " I will do what I want -button". It happens , I'm aware of it.
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Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, August 4, 2009 - 2:02 PMI have a theory that people who feel the need to ignore the personal aspects of these situations and instead choose to analyze all the time do so because they're avoiding their own issues. You have no right to label of pass judgment on any aspect of what happened in someone's relationship... and I notice Ron stopped defending the indefensible but you kept on.
More and more I get the impression that helping others isn't really your aim at all, but a false sense of moral and emotional superiority. Of course, I'm sure you'll respond with more psychobabble to justify every offense instead of ever owning up. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, August 4, 2009 - 2:42 PMI'm interested in creating a space where Ron or anyone else who chooses to can speak about themselves and there relationships if they choose to. I'm not defending Ron, he speaks for himself when he wants to. I only know what ron has said and what his ex's friends say, I am not privy to the "personal aspects of the situation" to even ignore them fully. Perhaps I have triggered stuff in others, as this thread has triggered stuff in me. I actually only know what this brings up in me, my parental issues,my issues about financially supporting men in my life, my own feelings. I actually have every right to label and judge things, we all have that right. It necesarry for survival too . Analyzing creates some distance from things, which I am thankful to have in this situation.
How superior can I get? I lived through a similar situation with my mom, financially supporting men in her life , I may be there some day myself. Seems like a painful situation all around. I have empathy for people in draining relationships, wheather it's financial or emotional or spiritual drain. I've been there. I'm trying to learn how to not be there again. Labeling and judging could help. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, August 4, 2009 - 3:21 PMYou responded just as I thought you would. ... and you cannot create a space for anyone to do anything on this tribe because it is not yours to control. Pretty arrogant, IMO. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, August 5, 2009 - 5:06 AMYeah she is pretty damn predictable isn't she. Not to mention more than a bit egocentric.
JSin -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, August 5, 2009 - 12:45 PM"people are free to speak about themselves and their relationships here. but if they say things that are inaccurate or incomplete, others are free to speak up, too, to set the record straight, or to make sure other sides of a story are represented. "
I totoally agree. I thik we can't be innacurate about our own view point, our own feelings about something though. It's seems to be he said/ she said in this case. I still don't understand why she needed so much defending. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, August 5, 2009 - 1:03 PMIt was like the defending took on a life of it's own. It was interesting to watch. Lots of defending or defensiveness is interesting to me. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, August 5, 2009 - 1:16 PMJust out of curiousity, did you even look at your part in this? Or are you soooo self involved and arrogant as to believe you were being helpful?
JSin
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, August 5, 2009 - 1:57 PMSo happy we could entertain you Aschleigh. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, August 5, 2009 - 3:07 PMyes, my own defensiveness interests me too. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, August 18, 2009 - 9:45 PMUgh. I'm kinda glad that I've been out of circulation for a while, now that I've read what's been going on on this thread. :oP I love you, l.ladies!!! XO! -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sat, September 12, 2009 - 10:12 PMI have an oral fixation so bj's for me are awesome!!!! -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sun, September 13, 2009 - 11:29 AMBj's and oral fixations; I'm all for it too!
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Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, August 4, 2009 - 3:46 PMpeople are free to speak about themselves and their relationships here. but if they say things that are inaccurate or incomplete, others are free to speak up, too, to set the record straight, or to make sure other sides of a story are represented.
and yes, i can see you have been triggered here, ashleigh, though you haven't triggered anything in me other than an urge to get you to use a web browser with spell check (firefox for instance), and a promise that you'll re-read your posts to see if they make any sense. it feels like you often just rattle off responses without the proofreading, editing and refining that are invaluable for well-thought-out communication. in the long run, sloppy writing about important thoughts erodes your credibility. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, August 4, 2009 - 9:33 PMI'm not taking anything you're saying personally, Aschleigh. I gave a brief explanation of why I got so specific about defending my friend, because it's usually not my style to go there online, & I don't feel entirely comfortable about it. I think I owed a quick explanation to anyone who reads this thread, & to Ron.
And again, nothing personal, Aschleigh, but really, I'm kind of ignoring your last few posts; just skimmed 'em. You are free to stop reading this thread anytime if it upsets you.
As Leslie said, your triggered feelings are your own to deal w/- it's NOT ABOUT YOU. I promise that my intent has nothing to do w/ you. Every aspiring therapist certainly has to learn that. I don't want to be unkind, but I'm more concerned about other issues in this case. I'm not writing nasty abusive flamers... If you get triggered by older women speaking their minds, or women who look out for one another...well, so do many other people- hence the fear of powerful/mature females. If you're lucky, someday you'll be one!
Leslie's not yr mom. Neither am I- I'm no one's mom, matter of fact, & not very maternal. You're a big girl, this is an adult forum, & you can take care of yourself. So can Ron.
The only reason I continued to chime in was out of loyalty to my friend, & to keep hammering home a point I believe is essential to truly consensual sex, & basic respect.
Appreciate support from friends; I'm done w/ this discussion.
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, July 27, 2009 - 12:55 AMAnd the 'battle' continues. Men, continue being so, and don't waste more time with those who won't fulfill your needs.
There are better matches waiting for them.
~ Kole
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sat, June 6, 2009 - 2:39 PMi haven't had an attitude adjustment in a very long time....
it's a two way street...oral sex...and it's not fun when it turns into a one way.
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, May 27, 2009 - 2:58 PMthe more I read this thread, the more brain cells die screaming... -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, May 27, 2009 - 4:55 PM<the more I read this thread, the more brain cells die screaming...>
Agreed, Ashleigh even the loftiest person likes to get laid and oral sex is a fun and wonderful component. As Jsin mentioned previously, you seem to be missing the point.
Blow jobs make people happy. Happy people have better relationships. It's really quite simple. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, May 27, 2009 - 7:52 PMIndeed, I am lofty or I have lofty ideas and I like to get laid. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, May 27, 2009 - 7:59 PMAnd if giving blow jobs made relationships great , than I would be very happy and very married right now.
There may be more than Jsin/Ron type opinions in men.
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Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, June 9, 2009 - 7:50 PMBTW, I was agreeing with this:
"the more I read this thread, the more brain cells die screaming... "
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sun, June 7, 2009 - 10:27 AMHehe... I don't know about saving the entire marriage.... but it sure would be a major plus in um, you know, enjoying each other's company again. :) -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, June 9, 2009 - 9:59 AMRO proclaimed:
<Hehe... I don't know about saving the entire marriage.... but it sure would be a major plus in um, you know, enjoying each other's company again. :)>
DING DING DING!!!
RO is obviously a woman who gets it :D -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, July 13, 2009 - 8:55 PM"Blow jobs make people happy."
No... blow jobs make a man relaxed and sexually satisfied for a little while. If a person is unhappy, sex may make them feel a little better for a few minutes, while the serotonin is in their system, but they will still be them when it wears off, they will still have all their same problems, all the issues and neuroses, etc.
"Happy people have better relationships."
Never in question.
And let's be clear - giving a man a blow job is great, and should be an option in the overall play, but if you give him a blowjob so that he pops a nut, the average guy is going to suddenly lose all motivation to continue playing, meaning reciprocation suffers. How often do we give them and still be able to get laid?
And it's great to say that a woman should give more blowjobs, but when do we get the article that says men should give women more oral sex to keep them happy?
Hell, where is the article that says a woman will feel more like giving blowjobs if she hasn't busted her ass all day cleaning up, cooking, etc while he watched tv... A tired, worn out woman is not a sexy woman OR a sexually interested woman.
Putting his cock in my mouth will always get his attention, but if we're counting on that as a relationship tool, the toolbox must be pretty empty. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Tue, July 14, 2009 - 10:20 PMI read that fine piece of groundbreaking journalism. Men like blowjobs. Wow, that's SUCH startling news!! Stop the presses!
Another formula... Hmmm, kinda like David Dieda or Just Say No or One Man One Woman or Poly is for Superior People Who Never Get Jealous.
BTW I sure like oral. I like it both ways- he gets it, I get it. When the relationship is going at least pretty decently or better, it all happens. A LOT. Yummy...
What I don't like, ever, is the expectation that I HAVE to let anyone into any part of my body because I somehow owe him. There is little that turns me off faster, & trust me, when I'm hot for someone, I don't "withhold." How could I "withhold" what belongs soley to me in the first place- my body, my desires, my feelings, my limits?
I do & say what I feel, for real. I keep a partner's happiness & pleasure in mind.
And that's that. No bullshit. I'm a person, a free person who loves sex, not a goddamn receptacle. And I don't give blowjobs out of fear or take well to bullying. Sex used as a manipulation weapon is lousy, whatever the angle.
Many, many woman don't usually come from straight fucking, no matter how much we love it. I'm one of them. I need direct clit stimulation to get off. The vast majority of men who can get it up, DO come just fine from fucking.
So who do you think needs oral even more?
We don't hear about women's needs for what works regarding the down & dirty mechanics of sex nearly as often. Owning our desire & raw needs- It's still not quite ladylike enough, lol. And we know that there are still too many men that would rather believe they have the copyrite on need to orgasm.
Uh... No. Sure I can get off w/ my vibrator. But there are plenty of times I'd rather have his head between my legs, doing it just the way I like it. Gosh, that makes me happy.
But not if I know he's not particularly into it right then. And if he's not (but often is) that's just fine. He doesn't OWE me.
Please, take the "job" out of blowjob.
It's not my job. When I want to do it, it's my pleasure. Notice, there's no "job" in any expression we have for eating out a woman. Not because it's not sometimes an act of skill & stamina... it's likely because it's not seen as a friggin' JOB!!!
Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr... It's so easy to play the card of being a chick that "gets it." I get it. And strangely enough, I still have these funny ideas about authenticity, respect & equality co-exisiting w/ flaming hot nasty sex. Go figure. I'm such a bitch.
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, July 15, 2009 - 9:37 AMFMM disclosed:
<Please, take the "job" out of blowjob. >
I like Stewie from Family Guy's take on the situation. Let's call it a "trouser friendly kiss".
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Re: A chick that gets it
Wed, July 15, 2009 - 1:17 PM"How could I "withhold" what belongs soley to me in the first place- my body, my desires, my feelings, my limits? "
I love you. Just needed to say that.
"Sex used as a manipulation weapon is lousy, whatever the angle. "
Well...yeah... but if I get turned on listening to the noises he makes when he's all helpless and overwhelmed and stuff, and I'm loving the power I have to draw it out and make him insane, etc, does that make it selfish or manipulative? I guess technically, I reasons for giving might be questionable. But he seems happy.
; )
"It's so easy to play the card of being a chick that "gets it.""
Yup. Pet peeve. Set a random standard and suggest that anyone that doesn't meet it isn't cool or part of the gang. "a REAL ___ would know that."
Whatever.
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Re: A chick that gets it
Thu, July 16, 2009 - 4:02 PMI have been in a relationship with a girl who absolutely hated giving blowjobs, but knew how much I enjoyed them. Because she didnt develop a taste for it (pardon the pun) , She wasn't knowledgeable about doing well anyway. I silll loved her and had intercourse. What makes a felatio good for me is if the girl enjoys herself too. A girl whos into it makes it soooooo hot and enjoyable. If I have to really ask for one, its not worth it. I would rather not have her do it or expect it.
I love eating pussy though. and because I did and didn't expect a blowjob in return, all of a sudden she started doing it for me and enjoyed it. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sat, July 18, 2009 - 11:03 PMThanks for the positive feedback.
<<<"Sex used as a manipulation weapon is lousy, whatever the angle. "
Well...yeah... but if I get turned on listening to the noises he makes when he's all helpless and overwhelmed and stuff, and I'm loving the power I have to draw it out and make him insane, etc, does that make it selfish or manipulative? I guess technically, I reasons for giving might be questionable. But he seems happy.>>>
Uh, no way do I think of that kind of fun as bullshit manipulation. I think of that as one of the hottest payoffs for giving pleasure & surrendering to it there is! Pretty delicious description!
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sun, July 19, 2009 - 5:51 AMThe biggest issue to me that is addressed in the article is that the downfall of many "monogamous" relationships is lack of sex and physical intimacy. Whether you believe it or not and whether someone as an individual does it or not, the reality is many women when they get married suddenly start withholding sex or deciding that they are only going to allow a very limited menu.
That is going to create resentment.
The actual act of bobbing a knob is a minor part of that formula.
Yes I do know there are guys that sit on their ass all day watching sports on TV or playing video games. This is as wrong as the woman who decides once she has a ring on her finger that suddenly she is a nun.
JSin -
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This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
Re: A chick that gets it
Sun, July 19, 2009 - 10:55 AMIt depends who we are as people. I actually think we agree here Jsin, we want relationships that involve sex in them, great sex.
It doesn't take a lot of intelligence to figure out that if I withhold sex from my partner , I am withholding sex from myself. ( if I choose monogamy).
Why not just get into relationships with smart, sexy people , who like sex and can communicate ? Wouldn't that solve the issue , if there is one? -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sun, July 19, 2009 - 11:06 AMFortunately it is not a problem in my life... I had one girlfriend who decided once she moved in that she no longer should have to bother to take care of her self or put effort into the sexual part of the relationship... She went away.
I was looking at the larger picture with the post.
JSin -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Sun, July 19, 2009 - 11:09 AMyeah, people who don't care of themselves are very difficult partners. for sure. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, July 20, 2009 - 2:45 PMLook, nothing wrong w/ going the extra mile sometimes to please a partner in the nookie dept. Most of us do it, w/ happy results, whether immediate payback or long-term mojo karma. And I'm not so PC that I can't joke about sexual favors. But underlying that, there must be a bedrock of real respect & free will. Or it ceases to be funny.
That isn't the way that fluffy article comes across, & neither does supporting it's tone. It sounds like another tired "keep in line & keep yr man" piece of dreck enforcing male entitlement. I HATE the idea that sex is being "witheld". Rejection sucks, & sure, sometimes people (male or female) play power games. But just because someone doesn't want to have sex, or have it in a certain way, doesn't mean they are "witholding". PEOPLE CAN'T "WITHOLD" WHAT BELONGS TO THEM IN THE FIRST PLACE!!! No one is OWED sex!!!
Because what this is about, really, is power. And hurt/anger over rejection, that cry to be unconditionally loved even when it's not earned. The idea that any smart woman knows that a man's sexual satisfaction is, why push comes to fear of losing him, so much more important than her own desires, her own needs. He is entitled. She should play along.
Like good mamas do for babies. A good mama doesn't expect payback or from a baby, or that a baby will do his share of the emotional & sexual work in a relationship. Or the financial & physical drudgery of housework now, does she? Doesn't matter if she's tired, or feeling restless or bored. Nope, she just takes care of baby- because he needs her to survive & thrive. Gotta be done, no matter how she's feeling.
Grown men are not babies.... or shouldn't be. We all have baggage. Hoisting our own & knowing what's in there, pulling our own weight so we don't dump shit around is our job as adults. I'm not interested in being anyone's angelic, maternal "better half." I just want to be a relatively good person.
There is always a price to be paid somewhere down the line, from accepting favors from people who don't sincerely want to be doing them, & aren't straight up about negotiation. Some guys don't care. They know the score, & play the oldest game- the kind of sex they want, from the kind of woman they envision, for a literal price, legal or backstreet, understood or straight business transaction.
Just don't complain if that's what you buy into.. .
Anyone not infirm can mostly orgasm on their own. We need & want other people for touch, love, talk, play, etc. This is not about orgasms. -
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Re: A chick that gets it
Mon, July 20, 2009 - 6:03 PMGrown men are not babies
We are all pretty much babies until we deal with our own stuff, take care of ourselves , take responsibility for ourselves. We don't exactly live in a culture that knows that yet. I'm not looking for a son either, grown men/ grown people voice their needs and wants and deal with the consequences of the possibilitiy of not having them met or the fun of having them met.
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